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Aldridge proposes Smart, Young for Noel, Covington deal

Chuck - Red's Army June 29, 2015 James Young, Marcus Smart, Rumors 38 Comments

TNT’s David Aldridge offers up a dozen off-season moves, one of which is a deal between the Celtics and Sixers:

9. The 76ers should trade Nerlens Noel and Robert Covington to Boston for Marcus Smart and James Young

An easy, need-based deal for both teams, who doubled up on what they’d done in last year’s Draft with this year’s Draft picks. The Sixers went for Jahlil Okafor instead of Emmanuel Mudiay — taking the biggest upside, as they do every time — while the Celtics went for two more guards in Terry Rozier and R.J. Hunter after taking Smart and Young in the first round last year.

Philly now has Okafor, Noel, Joel Embiid (admittedly, with seemingly serious foot issues) and Dario Saric (who will play one more year in Europe before coming over) in its frontcourt, but has a dearth of quality guards. Smart was up and down in his rookie season, but he’d immediately be the starter at the point in Philly, and Young would get minutes and an opportunity to show what he can do after being in the D League most of last season.

Meanwhile, Boston currently has the four guards it’s drafted in the last two years, along with Isaiah Thomas and Bradley, with a less-than-imposing front line, and could certainly work Noel’s rim protection into its rotation (though, to be fair, the Celtics’ defense improved noticeably last season). Something has to give here. Both teams are way, way under the cap and none of the players involved here make any significant money, so each team could still hit free agency hard this summer and next.

Please note, this is not a rumored trade. It’s a suggestion by Aldridge.

My initial reaction is… who the hell is Robert Covington? He’s an undrafted small forward who spent the last two seasons with the Rockets and Sixers. He averaged 13.5 ppg (37% 3 FG) and 4.5 rpg in 70 games for Philly last season. Long story short, he’s a helluva 3 point shooter who doesn’t play much defense.

My second reaction to this proposal is… maybe? I understand you can’t swap Smart for Noel because guards are more common than rim-protecting bigs. But I’d like to think Young has a much higher ceiling than Covington. I’d be more apt to pull the trigger if the deal included a future #1 (not the Brooklyn picks) instead of Young.

Does Danny Ainge think RJ Hunter can/will be better than James Young? If so, he probably makes this deal.

Thoughts?

Justin

Personally I’d rather keep the guards through summer league. See what we have. Also make as big a push as possible to sign Robin Lopez. I dunno why he isn’t more talked about. Lopex and Tobias Harris would be two fantastic signings.
- Richard Jensen
  
  Side note: I always have to ask myself, “Is Robin Lopez the one who combs his hair?”
  - Curt Hays
    
    Robin is Batman’s sidekick. Robin Lopez is Sideshow Bob (from The Simpson’s).
- Ubuntu
  
  Exactly. With Young’s reported weight gain he could be used in a lineup like Thomas-Hunter-Young-Harris-Lopez to create super spacing and shooting.
- Banner18
  
  Agree. But at what cost? Harris likely will be a max guy. If Hayward and Parsons are 14-15m a year players than he is too. These 4/60 type deals are the new 4/36-4/44 type deals guys like Jeff Green and Deng signed 3-5 years back. These are what your 3rd or 4th best players will be making. Non-all-stars. The article that said this summer should be the one in which C’s prepare themselves to say in the summer of 2016 and 2017 “we are now one piece away” then that piece will be a 20m a year all-star and if Lopez costs 10+ million a year over 4 years can we make the cap room?
forever_green

I’d much rather have Philly’s problem with all those bigs.
I’d do that trade!
I stand by what I said Young was a waste of that Brooklyn pick.
- Ubuntu
  
  That’s crazy man. Young’s upside is tremendous, you don’t just give that up for guys like Noel and Covington.
  - forever_green
    
    I know, most people feel like you about Young.
    - Sean McLaughlin
      
      I’m with you. Believe it when I see it. And still haven’t seen anything outta him on the NBA level…
      - Ubuntu
        
        Maybe because he’s only been in the league one season and he’s only 19 lol
      - Sean McLaughlin
        
        Well, while the first point is most certainly valid, it doesn’t take away from the fact that many people are giving him more credit than he deserves at this point and time. I hear he’s working hard in the gym this summer, and I sincerely hope he does turn into the “all star caliber shooter” that people are claiming he is. But when you have a chance to trade for another rookie that’s already proven he’s NBA ready to make a significant contribution like Noel, you have to at least consider it. 1 in the hand is worth 2 in the bush, right? And the age argument is actually a misnomer, because if he wasn’t ready, he shouldn’t have declared for the draft. I don’t hate the guy, don’t even necessarily want him off the team. Just saying anyone that claims he has so much upside doesn’t really have a leg to stand on. Many players over the years have been PHENOMENAL in college, the D-Leagues, etc, but can’t hack it or are simply mediocre in the NBA. Take Tyler Hansborough for example.
Ubuntu

This trade is no for so many reasons.

1. Noel has potential to be a great defender, but that’s all. His rebounding is still iffy, and he has zero offensive game. We can easily get a guy like that in free agency. Robert Covington is a 24 year old sophmore who can shoot, but had imploded stats thanks to playing for the Sixers.
2. Robery Lopez, Roy Hibbert, etc. are right now better options than Noel, and don’t involve giving up assets.
3. The draft and free agency class next year is deep at the center position. Could easily get a place holder guy this season then get our center of the future next year who could have just has much if not more upside than Noel.
4. Giving a division rival Marcus Smart and James Young would be handing them a high potential backcourt to pair with Jahlil Okafor and Joel Embiid. You’d speed up their rebuild for a rotation shooter, and a shot-blocking big who’s upside is still questionable.
5. James Young is now 6’7 230 ibs with a 7’1 wingspan. Size is similar to Draymond Green. He could potentially be a guy that you cold plug in from 2-4, and create matchup mismatches all over the court. You want to trade that AND Marcus Smart who most feel will be at least an all-star for Nerlens Noel and Robert Covington?
- Banner18
  
  I don’t want to give up Young either. But Smart + assets for Noel is a no-brainer. since I agree with your #4-5 I will comment on 1-3.
  1. Noel can be a great defender and a decent offensive player as well. If that is all he is then he is more valuable than Smart and even additional assets. He just turned 21 and in his first full season averaged 10 points, 8 rebounds and 2 blocks in 30 minutes and was a 61% FT shooter. 9.5 rebounds per 36 minutes from a 20 year old in his first year is not ‘iffy’ rebounding (Lopez 8.7 per 36 mins). His PER this season was 15 and should soon be in the 17-19 range that Noah, Gortat, Hibbert and DeAndre Jordan always reside in. We’d be paying 2-3 times that much on the free agent market for a player like Lopez, who will be slightly better than Noel for maybe one season, but not beyond that.
  2. If Hibbert opts in with Indy and the Pacers will take Wallace and some $ to make the salaries work and a future lotto protected 1st then that is a good move b/c he’d be on a one year deal and would barely eat into our 2015 cap space while preserving it for 2016. However, Lopez at 4 years 50 million (or w/e the largest deal he might command will be) is not nearly as good an option as Noel. He will not match Noel’s defensive skills years 2-4 of that deal and might not even better him on offense. Biyombo is only 24 years old, on the Avery Bradley deal (4/32) he would be a guy I’d invest long-term in who will rebound and block shots at the rate Noel would without giving up Smart. But he is a terrible FT shooter and after 4 years in the league you can’t expect any offense from him, so he’s limited.
  3. The draft and free agency next year are deep at center? I see only one guy in the draft, Skal, who will be a difference maker at center, and he will need 2-3 years of development. Maybe Poeltl could be. In free agency the 2016 class of centers is nowhere near as good as this one. If Howard opts out it would be ok, but he is not coming here. You have a bunch of guys around age 30 like Noah, Horford (more a PF) and Hibbert next year. Noel or Biyombo would be much better fits for the current roster and direction of this team. Even overpaying Koufos or Robin Lopez NOW at age 27-28 is better than to wait a year to pay Noah or Hibbert more when they are 30 and probably not interested in Boston anyhow.
  - Ubuntu
    
    I’m using game tape and if you watch Noel’s technique he doesn’t look for bodies a lot when he goes up for rebounds it’s just in Philly they aren’t trying to win so they’ll play him 30 minutes anyway. If you watched him on offense you would see that he literally has no offensive game which isn’t necessarily needed, but trading two two-way players for one guy with defensive potential doesn’t cut it for me. Also from someone who watches a bit of college basketball I can tell you that their will be at least 4-6 Centers drafted in the first round. I need to see more from Noel before I can see I’d give up Smart or Young for him.
- Curt Hays
  
  Are you Alex? Don’t lie.
- duh
  
  Do you know what “imploded” means?
  - Ubuntu
    
    Meant inflated. That’s what i get for multi-tasking.
mark3436

Can he propose a trade for Jahlil He could probably be our franchise player
david

How about Bradley and RJ Hunter instead
Adam Stark

I’d rather not. Bradley is the one that need to go. I think he has pretty much hit he’s peek. I’d like to see a Rozier-Smart back court. Pressy and Babb can be cut or traded. Maybe Wallace, Olynyk, Pressy and Babb for Hibbert. Might teach Zeller a thing or Two. I hope Danny will be calling Tobias Harris at 12:01 AM Wednesday too.
bosox62

Celtics need a true big center to clog up middle round basket I miss Kendrick perkins .
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Banner18

I would not include James Young in the proposed deal, only because within our division he could come back to haunt us. Smart will be as good a PG/SG as Noel will be a PF/C. I think the swap makes lots of sense and the scarcity of bigs requires more from the C’s end. I honestly would do Smart, Olynyk or Sullinger AND a top 10 protected future pick of Philly’s choosing. That is all for Noel, they can keep Covington.
Richard Jensen

Philly’s not going to do a trade like this because they might get good. And according to Sam Hinkie’s 205 year plan, they can’t be good until at least 2062, or so. Around when Sam Hinkie III is in his first years running the team.
Jester00

in short Hunter will be better but that is like saying who was better Mike Smith or Stojko Vrankovic. google that one folks
Willions

This is a horrible trade for the sixers. Smart and young both shot under 37% last year. Noel finished in the top 10 in blocks and steals and the sixers are going to trade him and their only shooter for a guy who’s barely worth a second round pick and PG with similar weaknesses to the one they just traded? Go Knicks!
Sean McLaughlin

I think his thinking is that the Sixers may really value Noel given the uncertainty on the Imbiid situation, so we’d have to offer them two quality (semi in Young’s case) to convince them to make the trade. If this trade went down I’d see Trader Dan instantly shipping covington off on a smaller deal, or dealing with the lovable but mediocre Phil Pressey situation.
william20

Stupid article why would they trade Noel who is coming into his own he has the potential to be one of the top big men for years to come. We already were robbed when we traded Nick Vuke and ended up with one of the biggest stiffs in the history of sports Bynum no thank you
- Banner18
  
  The Sixers WILL trade one of Embiid or Noel eventually. That is, if Embiid isn’t the next Bynum and actually recovers and is healthy. Okafor will be an offensive star/defensive liability who needs either Noel or Embiid to back him up at center and cover his a– as a rim-protecting PF when on the court together. Philly could wait until both are healthy and do a deal at the deadline or even the 2016 draft, but rest-assured, unless Embiid is done they will be trading him or Noel. Personally, I’d take Eric Bledsoe for Noel now. The plan is one more year (at least) of sucking, with your own 1st rd pick, the Lakers 1st and Saric all joining after next year and Embiid being eased along slowly. But, a Celtics offer of Smart, Sully and a 1st rd pick falling in the teens for Noel should be pretty tempting as well. If you get full-health from Embiid, Saric coming over and looking like Kukoc/future elite 6th man, and use your three 1st rounders on a lights out shooter at PG who can backup Smart/play alongside him (Melo Trimble) a defensive minded PF/C who can run the floor (Amidah Brimah) and your own top 5 pick on a legit future star/starter at SF (Simmons/Brown/Ingram) then the 2016-17 Sixers will look like the current Timberwolves as far as a bright future in concerned.
  - william20
    
    great well thought out stuff buddy as well as very interesting. I don’t feel the same way as you regarding one of the big guys. You are probably 100% correct however I was hoping to see the three of them playing together just to see how they jelled and if it would work. I think people are forgetting Tony Wroten who IMO is only like 21 and I see a big upside once he learns the point guard position. Anyway again great stuff thank you.
    - Willions
      
      I also don’t think Wroten is very good. There’s a reason Memphis gave up on him. Maybe this also explains my opinion of Smart. If you are a mediocre shooter who isn’t great at setting up teammates as a PG, I think you’re ceiling is a bench player on a good team. Either way, solid points I just don’t see things exactly the same.
      - william20
        
        And that’s ok we have different opinions and I respect yours and anyone else whether they agree or disagree this is why I enjoy talking sports. I believe Tony W has a wealth of potential needs to improve his shooting and turnovers. What I like is the way he takes the ball to the hoop fearless doesn’t mind contact
    - Banner18
      
      I didn’t forget Wroten, he is solid, I had him penciled in as your starting SG for many, many years. If you were to start Smart, Wroten, Simmons/Brown, a healthy Embiid and Okafor next year with Trimble, Covington, Saric, Sully and Brimah off the bench I’d say that would be one of the most exciting young teams in the league. If you were to trade for Bledsoe (and nothing else) I think you’d be slightly better next year than with Smart/Sully (possibly missing out on that top 3 pick you need) and then wouldn’t have an extra pick in the teens to boot, unless PHX was offering their 2016 #1. Plus, right when you are ready to compete in 3-4 years Smart will be entering his prime and Bledsoe exiting his. I definitely see Smart being a better player (not necessarily PG) by 2018-19. Go back to 2006. Even if Smart is, at his worst case scenario, a Tony Allen 6th man type with the handle to play backup PG, wouldn’t you want a 25 year old Tony Allen in 2006 over a 31-32 year old Allen Iverson, a short scoring PG (kinda like Bledsoe) whose defense was only good b/c he was super fast, but after age 30 that starts to go away. Bledsoe will be 29-30 at the end of his deal looking for a max contract through age 34 at 20-25 million per. Smart will be 25 and looking for that first max in the 15-16 mil range assuming the CBA stays the same as it is now.
      - william20
        
        All I can say my goodman is you carefully thought this plan out and I wish Ruin Tomorrow Jr had your vision, I like the moves you are talking about great stuff buddy
      - Willions
        
        I have to agree to a certain extent. I wouldn’t love Bledsoe if I were the sixers for the same reason I wouldn’t love sully now. By the time the sixers will be ready to compete both are going to be late 20s and wanting a lot of money. Smarts upside is probably a better fit. I do feel like anointing him as a elite wing defender at only 6’4 is still a little early but I didn’t watch him for 82 games.
  - Willions
    
    I think the issue with this article and this thread is that Celtics fans and Aldridge apparently are putting too much value in guys like Smart and Young. Young was a mid-1st who showed nothing last year and has very little value. I read below that Smart is someone who “most feel will be at least an all-star”. That’s laughable. He not a star distributor and doesn’t shoot well enough to be a major difference maker scoring the ball. I think the sixers would consider Bledsoe for Noel, but not Smart. I agree with most of what you are saying, but I just don’t see Smart or Sully being that appealing.
    - Banner18
      
      The two guys I see Smart becoming a lot like (if the C’s are lucky) are Dennis Johnson and Chauncey Billups. When DJ was Smart’s age he was of course still in college. Billups we all know entered after his soph year like Smart and spent 5 seasons puttering around 4 teams as a borderline starter averaging 10pts/3 assists, no set position, before finally breaking out on those Detroit teams as a PG. He was basically the same player as Smart only not quite as good a defender but a slightly better 3 point shooter (in his early 20’s he was nothing special) and a much better FT shooter. Johnson was a SG for his first 4 seasons in Seattle, but shot only 43-44% from the floor, never averaged 20 points, 3 pointers didn’t exist until his 4th season (and he was NEVER even halfway decent at them) and he didn’t average 5 assists until his 7th season, the year before he came to Boston. He was 6’4″ (like Smart) defended the heck out of guys 6′-6’9″ (like Smart) and wanted badly to win, had tons of heart but also rubbed some teammates the wrong way (possibly like Smart). If you think Smart can’t become like Billups or DJ after his rookie age 20-21 season you gotta be kidding me. At the very LEAST he is Tony Allen with a handle. A valuable disruptive athlete/all-league defender with the added bonus of being your backup PG (which Allen cannot do). Smart at age 21 has almost the same promise as a defense first combo-guard as Noel has as a D first PF/C of the same age. The fact that rim-protection has more value and this is a 3 point happy league makes Noel have more value, which is why I was throwing in Sully and a 1st rd pick in the teens, the deal is VERY fair. If the Sixers still turned around and asked for a Young/Covington swap I’d consider it, but only if we got Tobias Harris and Danny/Brad were really, really high on Hunter becoming a starter by his 2nd year.

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